Wednesday, October 12, 2011

Criminal Minds Talk About episode 7.04 'Painless' Here

“Painless” – Survivors of a Boise high school massacre return to remember the event 10 years later, but the BAU team is called in when a new killer with a similar style targets the survivors. Also, Hotch is worried that his son, Jack, may be a victim of school bullying, on CRIMINAL MINDS, Wednesday, Oct. 12 (9:00-10:00 PM, ET/PT) on the CBS Television Network. 


  1. This episode ROCKED - HARD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is the best CM ep I have seen in a long time! Thank you Breen! You have restored my faith in the writing team.

  2. I didn't love that episode.
    I felt the same way after "52 Pickup" : the "funny" scenes are over the top, I especially feel this way when it's in the middle of the case.

    They're FBI agents working a serious case and Morgan simply hands out Reid's phone number for "fun" to reporters during said case !!!
    I'm sorry but Morgan was so unprofessional.

    Also, Reid went to Caltech, not MIT, and he was supposed to have gotten his three PhDs there.

    Recap to the writers : Reid graduated high school at 12, went to Caltech, got at least three PhDs there in :
    - Mathematics,
    - Engineering,
    - Chemistry.
    He has BAs in Psychology and sociology and probably one in Philosophy by one.

    One can argue that he still went to MIT at some point, but it really looks like another continuity failure.

    Where Reid is concerned I would prefer the writers to concentrate more on his genius.

  3. Amazing episode! loved it all! Very funny scenes with Reid and Morgan! Jack is such a nice kid! My favorite scene was between Hotch and Jack at the end! But so much to love about the episode! Interesting case with an unsub that was not shown in the first two minutes of the episode, was fun to try to guess who the unsub was. The boileroom Hotch, was afraid he would get shot!m scene was very suspenseful, wonder what would happen!

    Breen did a great job tonight! So did the cast too!

    So far I love, LOVE season 7!

  4. WTF was that? I thought I was watching CM but parts of it turned into some show with characters I didn't recognize...

    Did someone do crack before writing some of those scenes?

    Continuity and characterization were both killed in one fell swoop.

    I'm all for humor on the show-- I think it is essential-- but *NOT* at the expensive of characterization.

    That was some of the most unprofessional, out-of-character BS I have ever seen on the show.

    Had it not been those characters on this show it would have been fine, but really.... It turned this show into a farce.

    Hotch chewed out Jordon Todd for lying about some family tragedy to the family of a victim. Yet, its ok for Morgan to publicly lie to the press *on camera* and claim to be Reid and give out Reid's number?! During the middle of an investigation like this and suddenly out of the blue... It made no sense and was completely unprofessional. And Reid flipping out, while funny, was not in character either.

    Then they forgot that Reid went to Caltech. CALTECH damnit! And they say it's MIT now? WTF?

    And newsflash: Rossi was RETIRED at the time that case happened...

    I couldn't even focus on the case bc of that stupidity.. I just am left with a feeling of WTF...

  5. I SO agree with the previous anonymous comment, Morgan says he's Reid and hands out his phone number on camera...
    I'm sorry that was so unprofessional and out of character it wasn't even funny !
    Totally over the top !

  6. Continuity questions aside, I totally loved this episode. I was thrilled to get to see another part of Reid's personality, and I really hope to see more in future episodes of this "WAR!!!" between Reid and Morgan. I love that sort of interaction and hope it continues. (Reid really needs to win this one since it WAS rather rude of Morgan...)

    Maybe another writer can tie-in Reid's sudden MIT experience (maybe he got a PhD there in, say, a year or something?)?

  7. It was said that Reid got his three PhDs at Caltech, the article collected about his father even made a point about him NOT attending MIT or Standford.
    The only thing that would explain it would be Reid getting another degree at MIT after his three Caltech PhDs.

  8. Tonight's episode was great overall, in my opinion. I agree that Morgan's behavior seemed very unprofessional but I still loved the interaction it caused between him and Reid. I also loved the scenes between Emily and Hotch, and Jack with Hotch.

  9. Fantastic episode. This was on a par with earlier seasons. We want good suspense, good profiling and good team interaction not a lot of violence and gore. The scenes between Morgan and Reid were hilarious. We need more writing like this.

  10. Awesome. I loved all the team interaction. The part with Jack and Hotch at the end was beautiful. I also liked the fact that it wasn't overly graphic and gory. I'm LOVING season 7 so far!!!!

  11. agreed with jonishackley, we need more episodes like this one! It was a good one, funny moments, personal moments, a good case, some action and suspense.

    As for Reid saying he graduated from MIT, maybe he did, we know Reid is still getting PhD so who knows.

    Sure Morgan was a bit unprofessional but we have seen that from him when he did go out with the sister of a victim (Tamara Barnes) and doing this while he was acting Unit chief. Sure Hotch did get angry with Todd for lying but it was to the family.

    And really I just love that scene between Morgan and Reid, it shows that Reid can and will get back at Morgan!

  12. That's an episode I'll never watch again.

    Honestly, my reaction when I watched that episode was : " What the ....?" (not unlike some previous posters here apparently).
    No, the Morgan/Reid scenes WEREN'T funny and they WEREN'T the slightest bit in character.

    Hotch doesn't have anything to say about Morgan pretending to be Reid and giving his phone number on camera ????

    And yes, Jordan Tod anyone ?
    Hotch dissed her for potentially putting the FBI in a bad light with her lie.
    Morgan is even the one who said that on a Hotch scale she had messed up on a 11 out of 10.
    What Morgan did was much worse, professionally speaking; and Hotch is fine with it ????
    Funnily enough, the writer of that episode ("52 Pickup") is the same guy who wrote tonight's episode. What happened between these two episodes ?

    Also, shouldn't Morgan realize that publicly giving Reid's phone number like he did (ie : to total strangers) could potentially be dangerous ???

    I sometimes get the feelings that the writers are trying to make a point about the team never needing to be concerned about Reid anymore no matter what.

    Like others have said, Reid went to Caltech, and not MIT. He was supposed to have gotten his doctorates there.

    Reid's education is a very big part of the character so it's sad to see that the writers aren't even trying to make an effort by remembering where he went to college. It's really sad.

  13. I have to agree that this was very forced. Funny scenes are great... unless they are out of character.
    Any why mention cheetobreath? That was just odd.

  14. I haven't commented yet tonight but would like to add my impressions here. I was really looking forward to this episode, especially when one of the writer's, Sharon Lee Watson, had stated earlier that the show would be returning to the comraderie between Reid/Morgan that had existed in the past. I was looking for a good conversation scene between the two, and instead was treated to these characters playing childish and in Morgan's case potentially harmful pranks on each other. It was a huge letdown and I, for one, hope their scenes the remainder of this season will NOT consist of them getting back at each other with this "war of pranks."

    I was also shocked by Reid's SOB comment. Other characters have said this on the show and I don't like it. But at least my favorite character, Reid, never talked like this--until tonight's episode. I hope this is the ONLY time we hear him speaking that way. I think the best explanation for this would be to tie it in with his headaches and whatever illness he might have causing him to act and speak out of character--which it certainly was!

    The phone calls could have lead to something much more interesting had they not been the result of Morgan's prank. Who is calling Spencer and why? Is it about his mother, his headaches, or something else? Could it be a girl? Maybe it's a drug dealer or somebody connected to NA. You get the picture. Reid could have been using a phone Garcia could not trace or she could actually be loyal and refuse to invade his privacy.

    I didn't like that Reid wasn't in the opening and that there was no explanation given for it. Where was he? He should have been present for the team briefing.

    I liked Reid's basketball comment but was put off BIG TIME by JJ's observation that she was a nice girl, even to people like Reid. I think he would have been hurt and offended by that. She was condescending to him with her "micro-expressions" comment in "Proof" as well. So far, I miss the old JJ. This version doesn't work for me.

    On a positive note, I like that Reid is showing more of his knowledge first with cap symdrome and now with asymbolia. That's a plus.

    I hope the writer's do say that Reid has a degree in computer technology from MIT or something to clear that up. He does seem to be continuing with his education so it is not a stretch.

    Sorry this is mostly Reid observations/comments but since he is my favorite, he is the one I was concentrating on the most! Incidentally, I thought those promo photos with Reid at the elementary school were probably behind the scenes stuff. In a way, it would have been nice if he had gone to see Jack after hearing he might be being bullied. Reid knows what that is like and it would have made for a sweet Reid/Jack scene!

    I do like the Hotch/Jack scenes and it is nice to see Hotch being more of a leader again. When Reid got upset with that phone call, his "Reid..." spoke volumes. I'd like to see more of Hotch speaking to Reid as his unit chief. I'm thinking of the scene at the end of "Elephant's Memory." That's what I'd like to see more of with these two characters!

    I want the real Reid/Morgan friendship back! Where's the scene with them discussing the team betrayal? Surely they should get to share their thoughts with each other at least once!

    This episode had good moments and I did enjoy it. But the earlier items I mentioned above did take away from my overall enjoyment of the show. This is quite honestly the first time I was shaken up by what the writer's did with Reid. PLEASE NO MORE OBSCENE LANGUAGE from Spencer unless it is his illness talking!

  15. I loved this ep! Great work with the unsub. I felt like I was kept guessing pretty much through the entire ep as to who the unsub was.

    I respect everyone's opinion. However, being a former journalist that has been worked too many crime scenes, I can tell you from experience, the worse the case, the more the law enforcement officers will do exactly what Morgan did. It's a stress release. And Morgan didn't start the "battle". Reid did, by his own admission of hustling Morgan in the first three rounds of the basketball pool.

    On to the continuity issues. While in "Memoriam", Reid's thesis paper had CalTech on it, I honestly can not remember a CM ep where it said he got all three of his PhD's there. If someone states differently, I will stand humbly corrected. And then the "ten year" thing with Rossi. If following the CM "time line" (which we all know has been fudged with more than once), when Hotch and Rossi walked into the police station, he called Hotch "Agent Rossi" while he called Rossi "Dave". That tells me that Dave was not with the Bureau at the time, only consulting on the case. And Breen wrote this ep. Other than Erica, he's been there the longest and I'm sure has heard the fan base's gripe about continuity.

    And the last scene with Hotch and Jack was just too precious. "I don't want to make you sad daddy." Cade is just too damn cute!

    Btw, while I will post this as Anonymous (because I've haven't figured out how to do with a name), I'm rockhotch31.

    And to the absolute wonderful folks at CMRT, yes I'm the old fool you all so graciously wanted to help a couple of weeks ago. I'm just going to try this because you've got enough on your plate without helping the old girl across the street. And your site rocks! Thanks group!

  16. Loved, loved, loved this episodes. The case was strong.

    The Morgan/Reid prank war was hilarious. It reminded me of earlier seasons.

    Some people have a problem with the MIT thing but how do we know he hasn't completed another degree from MIT since S4 when they mentioned Cal Tech? This is guy who is a genius and constantly furthering his education. I just don't see how this is so unbelievable.

    Again, I could not have loved the humor between Reid and Morgan any more than I did. This was the best episode of CM after a long time. I loved that it had an "earlier season" vibe to it as well as a feeling that the characters had developed more over time.

  17. I was so shocked to hear MIT that I actually went looking for those articles from Memoriam just to make sure, and nope, it actually says:
    "When I ask why he chose Cal Tech over MIT and Stanford, he quickly runs down a list of Professors he had a desire to study with."
    And in another one:
    “Indeed, with three doctorate degrees from Cal Tech already…”

    And about Rossi still being in the BAU ten years ago:
    Season 3, Episode 6 - About Face:
    Erin Strauss – "You've been retired for nearly 10 years."
    And that was more than 3 years ago.

  18. And even though Reid could have gotten another degree, this time from MIT, why would he go all the way to Massachusetts if we saw him taking a local class during Outfoxed (5.08)? And it's not like he has the time.

    I just think it's too much to ask us to come up with a reasonable explanation for their lack of continuity.

  19. A great episode! I really liked it - suspense, profiling, humour, team moments, and great Hotch scenes. Loved Hotch with the teacher and with Jack. I thought there was a great balance in the episode, as I don't really like when it is all business and crime. I love the team moments, and Hotch is my favourite altho I like all the team. Yes Season 7 is off to a great start. this is my favourit episode, and some continuity issues don't bother me! Great CM keep it up!!

  20. Loved it! It rocked! A good story with tension. Well crafted script and good pacing. Great team moments!!! Really liked the humour and the pairings throughout the episode gave diversity from before. It wasn't all Prentiss with Morgan and Rossi with Hotch. Hotch was great this episode - plenty of him, and loved the sub theme re Jack. Yes a great episode!! Well done writers and actors!! Keep it up!

  21. That episode left me with a really bad taste in my mouth. I don't think that writer dosed the humor in the right way. I too hoped Hotch would have something to say to Morgan about his actions.

    Yes I remember those articles Reid's father collected. They said that Reid got his three PhDs at Caltech, so what was that reference about MIT ?
    Now, don't get me wrong, I could see Reid going to MIT too, and I don't have a problem with that, but that would have to be after he went to Caltech.

    Well, we know Reid keeps studying so maybe it was after he got in the FBI...Yes, quite a travel, so he would have to make the most of it I suppose.
    I wonder what degree he got at MIT (and if he's going to go to Massachusetts he might as well make the most of it). it would have made sense if he had gotten his PhD in Engineering there, but he got it at Caltech.
    Maybe he got another degree in Engineering there (in another field of Engineering I mean).
    That might be the more sensible answer to excuse that writer's mistake (and yes, come one, we all know it was a mistake here).
    At least, it would make me slightly happy to know that Reid got a second PhD in engineering there (Aeronautics/Astronautics for example would be good).

    Since it's now canon that Reid went to MIT I'll pretend that's what happened.

    Yes, the Criminal Minds writers are horrible when it comes to continuity.
    They either don't have a "character bible" for that, or they simply don't care enough about the fans who pay attention and like consistency.

    No matter what, with his degrees, Reid could have come up with something much more clever than the yelling at the end.
    Caltech students are know for their pranks, and they're much more elaborate and sophisticated than that. Same thing with MIT.
    Come on, Reid has PhD in Mathematics, Chemistry and Engineering.
    I would have preferred Breen Frazier to write a more subtle and much more clever "payback" from Reid.

    And, last question : Reid graduated high school at 12, could he really coach basketball at that age ?
    Unless that changed too (his age while he graduated high school), and I really hope not. Maybe he coached basketball in college.

  22. As much as I love CM and the characters and the writing, this episode was not one of my favorites. I think it's because I am a teacher and we are doing a type of emergency drill today. It hit too close to home. Just scared me a bit.
    And I do agree, some of the scenes seemed to be a little 'off', just how things happened.
    Still love the show, though! It will take more than one episode hitting me this hard to throw me off of the fan parade!

  23. Hotch doesn't have anything to say about Morgan pretending to be Reid and giving his phone number on camera ????

    Hotch didn't know what Morgan had done. If you want to be upset, be upset with Rossi for not letting Hotch know what Morgan had done.

  24. Just a technical note, it would be better if you leave a name when posting, make it easier when replying to posts. You can do that in two ways; sign your post at the end or choose Name/URL when you select a profile, just enter your name, no need for a URL.


    CMRT admin.

  25. Not my favorite episode of the season. The case and some of the profiling felt rushed.I somehow didn`t feel anything for any of the victims or the unsub.

    The Morgan/Reid pranking was funny but it was way too long and distracting. I`m fine with it if it was only for one episode. I hope though they don`t turn Morgan and Reid in some McGee/Tony (or whatever their names are) clones from NCIS because that`s what it reminded me of. CM is a dark show and that is the reason why I watch it and what makes the show different and better than other crime shows IMO. I hope we never see any of this NCIS-like banter stuff again. There are other ways to show the brotherly relationship Morgan and Reid have and to add a LITTLE humor to the show.

    The Hotch/Jack story was way over the top and also too long. The kid reads like a 4th grader? Sorry, but I don`t buy that. To me it seems he can hardly talk like a first grader. It was also unbelievable that Jack was inviting the kid who was mean to him home to solve their problems. The same with Jack not wanting to talk about his mommy because it makes daddy sad. Seriously, they make this child thinking and acting like a grown up but the character/actor comes over as a 4 year old child. He is cute though.

    JJ and Prentiss have been in contact all the time Emily was in hiding and Hotch is fine with it? Why was the rest of the team not even allowed to know that Emily is alive when JJ and Prentiss endanger Prentiss and everybody else by risking that Doyle is finding out that she is alive. This also contradicts what was said in "It takes a village" that Hotch and JJ didn`t know any of Prentiss identities. If Doyle was really that dangerous and watching everything the team was doing he wouldn`t have a problem finding out with whom JJ was playing "On line scrabble". Also, why was Haley then portrayed as being stupid for contacting her mom when she and Jack were in hiding.

    Overall only an average episode but since I liked the first three eps, I`m still optimistic about the season.

  26. "Hotch didn't know what Morgan had done. If you want to be upset, be upset with Rossi for not letting Hotch know what Morgan had done."

    Exactly, Hotch had no idea what Morgan did. Rossi didn't tell him and neither did Reid.

  27. You can't please everyone I suppose. People complain about the lack of character interactions/developments/moments, and we do finally get some, people still complain.

    Look, the characters are always on a case, obviously, and when Morgan pulls a prank or when Reid blew up at JJ in a previous episode, it's going to be unprofessional-they're always on a case. They have to put the character interactions somewhere. And if they were to try to fit in Morgan pranking Reid and Reid getting back at Morgan in the last three minutes, then people would say that it was rushed.

    I quite liked this episode, and not just because of the moments I found hilarious. The case was interesting and I was on the edge of my seat at points. When the unsub got back up the first time Hotch shot him, I was quite surprised because in what little time I forgot that the unsub doesn't feel pain.

    The Hotch & Jack moments were so sweet. It's always a pleasure to see Jack. And we did learn a tiny bit about Prentiss' time away.

    My favorite episode of the season so far, can't wait for the next one!

  28. I enjoyed this episode quite a bit too. I liked not being able to figure out who dunnit and I too enjoyed that the unsub didn't stay down when he was shot and reminded us that he couldn't feel pain.

    Hotch and Jack moments are always pure gold so the more the merrier and I thought little Cade was very articulate and sounded exactly like a six year old should.

    All of the Hull-a-ba-loo over the MIT reference is cracking me up. I don't remember such an uproar occuring when JJ's university changed from Pitt to Georgetown in "Zoe's Reprise".

    The misunderstanding about Reid's basketball comment has also been amusing. I can totally see a high school basketball coach using a 12 year old genius's mind to give his team the edge. Just because he has recalled some bad memories from his school years, doesn't mean the entire experience was all bad.

  29. That episode was a disappointment compared to last week's.
    The case wasn't bad, but I didn't find the Morgan/Reid pranks entertaining in the slightest. It annoyed me and made it difficult for me to try to enjoy that episode (which I didn't in the end).

    To Zagi :

    so, so glad to see I'm not the only one who rolled her eyes at Jack reading like a fourth grader. Soon they're going to tell us that he's a second Reid, only even better of course because he's going to be more intelligent, more coordinated and more sociable (anything less would be unacceptable for Hotch's son).
    Hell, Jack will soon teach Reid some chess strategies and will take pity on Reid and let him win once in a while.

    In my opinion, the important thing about humor in such a dark show is subtlety. And what we got last night was anything but subtle and it came out of the blue.
    I would have been more than fine with a little teasing in the jet or in the bullpen, but it went way overboard and was simply stupid.

    Even better, why can't the writers tell us what is wrong with Reid's mother ?
    That would have been bonding between Morgan and Reid if they had briefly talked about it.

    I guess the writers are not even sure if that storyline will really make it in the end. They'll wait and the whole thing might be dropped if they don't want to take time to show us an interesting Reid storyline. That's probably why Reid didn't say anything apart from a comment to JJ about having to deal with stuff concerning his mother during a weekend.
    It has been three years since we saw Diana Reid, three years. I hope they'll do whatever they can to get her back at least one last time on the show.

    To sf81387 :

    why are fans angry about the Caltech/MIT mess while they didn't make a big deal out of it for JJ ? Simple, Reid's education is a big, big part of the character. I'm not saying that it completely defines him, no, but his education and degrees have always been what set him apart to begin with. It explains why he was allowed to join the FBI at such a young age and why he went straight to the BAU. He's not a genius for nothing, so yes his college degrees are going to be an important factor for that character.
    I'm not saying that education isn't important for other characters, but it certainly isn't something that plays such a huge role in their personality. At least, not to Reid's extent.
    They have already messed up things were Reid is concerned before, and honestly it has never bothered me much, (I just thought : just another continuity fail). But, for a character like Reid, to not even remember what college he attended ? Now THAT bothers me greatly.

  30. Overall a great episode.
    Morgan/Reid banter was funny
    Loved the Emily/JJ stuff about being in contact throughout her time in Paris...
    Looking forward to some more episodes focused on great cases... and just a little of dipping into the characters

  31. to Cerene,

    Why is it so important that the writers visit, again, Reid's mother storyline? Lots have been mention about her, I for one want to know something else about Reid. he is not just define by his relationship with his mom. I prefer to see his relationship with the team members.

    As for seeing Jane Lynch on CM again, don't count on that as long as Glee is still on the air. Ed Bernero have mention in chats that it is next to impossible to get her back.

    About Jack Hotchner, why couldn't he be as intelligent as Reid or more socially adept? What does it takes away from Reid? Would a 6 years old be any competition to Reid? I don't get why the snark at Jack Hotchner ability to read as a fourth grader.

  32. My son could read at a 4th grade level when he was six. It didn't mean he was a future genius, it just meant he was bright and had a mother that took the time to read with him every night. Did anyone really expect that the child of Aaron Hotchner wouldn't be as bright as his father appears to be? I thought the boy was portrayed as a perfectly normal six year old and yes, they do tune into their parents grief and sadness regardless of how well a parent attempts to disguise it. I thought it was a very sweet scene.

    As for the Reid/MIT thing. I've never missed an episode of this show since the beginning and I enjoy the character of Spencer Reid a lot, but I have to admit that while I immediately picked up on the discrepancy with Rossi's timeline, I never noticed the discrepancy with the college that Reid attended. Maybe because I've heard him mention MIT before or maybe because it's just such a minor detail in my eyes that it didn't matter to me, but I must say I have enjoyed the uproar over it. Poor Breen Frazier is probably not going to want to chat tonight. LOL

    Oh and count me in the camp that really doesn't care whether or not we see anymore of Reid and his mommy issues. I don't care if we do, but if we don't I'll be okay too.

    That goes for all of the characters. I enjoy the little 1 minute moments at the beginning or end of the episodes that gives us a glimpse into their personal lives, but I don't want or need to see that stuff excessively. I would much rather enjoy watching Morgan and Reid as co-workers pranking one another than watching Reid angsting over his mother.

  33. Love this ep!! Has the feeling from start to finish of the old wonderful Criminal Minds episodes of seasons 3 and 4!!

    About the CalTech/MIT debate: have you ever stopped to think that with 3 PhDs in his pocket, maybe (just maybe) Reid got them from different Universities? #justsaying

  34. To Criminal Minds Round Table :

    It was important for me to see what was going on with Reid's mother because Erica Messer said in a chat (this summer) that Reid would have a "great stoyrline" this season and that Jane Lynch was involved, it was her own words and it made me (and a lot of other fans) happy.

    Others writers said that Reid was away for three months to deal with his mother, he's the one who took the sabbatical mentioned in the first episode of the season.

    And you're asking why I want to see more of it ? Well, because the writers created expectations when they told us that. They told us that Reid would have a storyline dealing with his mother.
    They shouldn't have started this if they were simply planing on dropping the story. I would just like to know if we're really going to see anymore of that like the writers promised us or if it's another story that has been dropped for Reid (like his doozy of a secret from last season that was supposed to be a huge story).

    I'm simply more cautious this time and I realize that even if Erica Messer and others promised us something on that front, they might not keep their word.
    But I certainly would love to see more of Reid and his mother, even if it's the last time she appears on the show, rather than Reid and Morgan pranking each other.

    The Hotch fans are entitled to enjoy the Hotch/Jack moments and we see a lot of that (and a crew member on twitter just said that we would soon see Jack again). The Reid fans should be allowed to enjoy some scenes and a story with him and his mother after three years of not seeing Diana Reid.

  35. "The Reid fans should be allowed to enjoy some scenes and a story with him and his mother after three years of not seeing Diana Reid."

    True! But the Reid's fans, or at least the part that don't get it, should be aware that Jane Lynch is, and has been for the last 3 years, playing a main character for a different show that is produced by a different network and a different studio so... Are you sure this is a case of Reid's fans not being allowed to, or something more mundane as having the actress even for one episode being nearly impossible!?

  36. To Maria :

    I perfectly know about Jane Lynch, that's why I was so pleasantly surprised when Erica Messer told us that she would be involved in a Reid storyline this season.
    I didn't think it would happen, but Erica Messer is the one who said that Jane Lynch "would be involved" in a chat I attended this summer.
    So, can you really blame me for being disappointed if in the end it doesn't happen ?

    What is even more frustrating is that Reid was away for three months to take care of his mother, the writers confirmed that, and we don't even know what was wrong with her.
    They could have had Reid explaining that much in an episode, but we didn't even get that. A simple mention about his mother's condition would have been great, but no.

    And I would take that any day over the Morgan and Reid pranking each other during cases.

  37. to Cerene: I totally agree with everything you said and Reid is not even my favorite character.

  38. Cerene, patience. We're only 4 episodes in and we've already had one episode that dealt with Reid's issues with being lied to. He and his issues can't be the focal point of every episode. I read somewhere that there is a Reid-centric episode on the near horizon so you'll probably learn more about what's been going on with his mother then. There was no reason for Reid to be angsty last night. Seeing the lighter side of the guy is entertaining me anyway.

  39. I have not read anything about Jane Lynch being on CM, the two chats I have attended with Erica Messer not once did she mention that Lynch would be back. I don't know if Erica did any more chats. Still, We already know that Reid was with his mom during the summer, maybe this will be mention again sometime later when the Reid storylines will be introduced, we have to be patient. This week storyline for Reid was his friendly prank on Morgan after he was provoked by Morgan.

    "The Hotch fans are entitled to enjoy the Hotch/Jack moments and we see a lot of that (and a crew member on twitter just said that we would soon see Jack again). The Reid fans should be allowed to enjoy some scenes and a story with him and his mother after three years of not seeing Diana Reid."

    Agreed, just like the JJ fans can enjoy storylines with her and Will and Henry, Garcia with Kevin, Rossi and his ex-wives.

    But you didn't answer my question concerning what you said here "so, so glad to see I'm not the only one who rolled her eyes at Jack reading like a fourth grader. Soon they're going to tell us that he's a second Reid, only even better of course because he's going to be more intelligent, more coordinated and more sociable (anything less would be unacceptable for Hotch's son).Hell, Jack will soon teach Reid some chess strategies and will take pity on Reid and let him win once in a while."

    I am asking again; why couldn't he be as intelligent as Reid or more socially adept? What does it takes away from Reid? Would a 6 years old be any competition to Reid? I don't get why the snark at Jack Hotchner ability to read as a fourth grader.

  40. CM is BACK! I loved this ep! It reminded me why I fell in love with this show in the first place! A thoughtful mystery, unusual clues, and the family is together. As for the continuity errors....I couldn't care less. After all, the writers have 7 characters, and almost 150 eps worth of info to remember. And I promise you, they have not seen all of the eps as often as the fans have. Give em a break!
    Great writing! (Yay Breen!) Loved it!

  41. I hate to say it, but this season is sucking ass. The characters are completely flipped and wobbly- and not in the good ways. Yeah, they're new writers, but good gosh, there's a point where they've gone too far that is so obvious and blunt that I don't see how they could miss it. I don't even look forward to the show anyone, I'd hate to say. If things don't turn around soon I'm out.

  42. To Criminal Round Table :

    Erica Messer did say that Jane Lynch would be involved in a Reid storyline this season, trust me on that. It was a chat done by another board and during the summer (I don't think I need to mention which board). There was a transcript of that chat, and I think you can still find it on said board if you look for it. Trust my memory on that, I wouldn't have forgotten that kind of details.
    She first said that Reid would have a great storyline this season.
    Then the fans were able to ask some questions, and someone asked her about Jane Lynch. Erica Messer said something like 'Yes, Yes ! the Reid arc involves Jane Lynch'. Go search for it if you don't believe me.

    Jack, as intelligent as Reid ? No, I certainly don't see it. We saw Reid when he was four year old, and we saw how he was, how he reacted, what he read... The kind of literature he had on his bedroom was Oscar Wilde, Dickens, Daniel Defoe and so on (and you could tell the books were his, he had probably read them for himself more than once). He also played chess at four and beat adults. Gideon was probably one of the very few people who could repeatedly beat him, but Reid managed to beat him at least once.

    So, no, I really don't think they're trying to portray Jack as a genius. But, they're trying to make him look too sweet and perfect most of the time. The whole 'dressing like daddy because he's a real superhero', 'this kid bullies me so I'll be understanding and try to make a friend out of him', 'I won't make daddy sad so I won't talk about what's bothering me'...At least it's my opinion, but I respect the fans who love the Hotch/Jack scenes.
    I hope they never portray Jack as a genius, we already have one on the show, it's enough.

    To sf81387 :
    yes, don't worry I'm patient. I'm not asking to see more of it right now but I would like to know if the writers will really address that issue at some point or not. If I knew for sure that they would make something with that stoyrline near the end of the season, I would be happy with that.
    I simply get the feeling they're backpedaling on that story and that's what bothers me.

    About the Reid centric episode, I have the impression it'll be more about his genius (and I'm delighted about that). The working title seems to be 'true genius' and the writer said that we would see his maps skills and more.
    I'm certainly hoping for a storyline that would do justice to Reid's intelligence and who would make full use of his scientific background.

    To Zagi : thanks. I enjoy the relationship between Morgan and Reid, it just seemed too forced and not natural last night. I prefer to see them teasing each other in the bullpen. The whole mention about the basketball thing and the pool would have been sufficient, it didn't need to evolve in a prank war during the case.

  43. Cerene, I was in that chat and I remember her saying that Reid would have an arc involving his mother. She never promised that Jane Lynch would appear, only that she would like to get her back for an episode if they could. If they can't swing it, they can't. She's a busy lady these days.

  44. To sf81387.

    Since no one seems to believe me I went back to look for the chat transcript and here is exactly what was said :

    "Cephalophile: Thanks for being here! Any chance of seeing Jane Lynch, despite her many other obligations?

    Erica_M: Yes!!!!!
    Erica_M: The current Reid arc that's being developed involves Jane... done"

    I would like post the link to that chat transcript but I'm not sure it I have the right to do so. If one of the mods could let me know.

  45. And just to precise, I know that it doesn't necessarily mean that Jane Lynch will really appear on screen. But at the very least Reid's mother, even if we don't see her, is supposed to be involved in the storyline.

  46. To Cerene,

    I found what you are talking about, it was a chat done on the CMF blog which I did attend, didn't remember that Erica said Jane would be back but it seem Jane will be back for the Reid arc. I stand corrected :)

    About Jack, I like that Jack is portrayed as a sweet kid. Yes he see's his dad as a superhero. Hotch is Jack hero, Jack is at an age when boy do see their father as invincible. Of course this may change as Jack gets older but for now at Jack age this is how a young boy would feel about his dad. We can say the same thing about Morgan, that he too did see his dad as somewhat of a hero, someone to emulate. Derek saw his dad, who was also a cop, been killed and now he too is in Law & Enforcement. It was the same with Elle, whose dad was a NY cop, who lost her dad at young age and she also became a cop. Also, Why can't CM have more than one genius? I would argue that Gideon was also a genius. As for Jack, he does have a very intelligent father and his mother seems intelligent too so why can their son be too? Is intelligence only measured by what you read and at what age? Just reading about 'How to Determine If Your Child Is a Genius' and being a genius is not just about what you read but more about how aware you are of yourself and others, how curious you are of the world around you and the people around you. But no one can agree on what genius is (

  47. No problem about the chat. I'm glad you could find it and see what I was talking about :).

    I don't see Jack as a genius at all, intelligent ? Yes, but not a genius.
    There's a difference, just because you're intelligent doesn't make you a genius. And real geniuses are exceedingly rare (it's not just about being gifted in a specific area). Reid is one and I don't think the show needs another one.
    Yes Jack is being portrayed as bright and curious, but not as a genius.

    About the mention of what Reid read when he was a kid, well no normal four year old kid would read that kind of literature, you have to be much more than bright to understand that when you're only four year old. Same thing with beating adults at chess when you're only four.
    "jack and the chocolate factory" is something that is much more normal for a six year old.

    My nephew is very bright too you know, he's advanced, understands quickly what is going on around him, is very curious and reads very well for his age. He's still not a genius.

    I'm repeating myself, but real geniuses are exceedingly rare.

    I think that they tend to show Jack as being too sweet. I'm glad if the Hotch fans like these scenes, no problem. It's just my opinion.

  48. To the anonymous who said that s7 sucks ass:
    Do you want me to show where the door is? Characters in TV shows are known for their characteristics, sure but does not mean they can't act uncharacteristically every once in a while. That makes it more realistic.

    I thought last night's episode was brilliant both from the case's POV and the personal touches. Great profiling and team interaction all around - the CM that we all love.

    I agree wih sf81387, we're only 4 episodes in. The writers can't tell all the storylines in one episode. That's why it's called a season. It needs time for stories to be told properly. Seriously, some people with their unbelievable expectations....

  49. I am looking forward to reading the transcript of the chat with Breen concerning this episode. I would like to hear/learn his point of view as to the choices he made for this episode, especially concerning Morgan/Reid as I was really looking forward to seeing one of their talks like in the past. I miss that so much! The pranks were not what I expected. I couldn't help but be disappointed when I'd been anticipating a real talk--concerning more serious subject matter. Reid has been seen talking with JJ and Emily and even Hotch though the latter one was brief. I get that the characters were addressing the deception. Morgan and Emily talked too, as did Rossi and Hotch. So why not Morgan/Reid in this episode? If not the deception and how they feel about it there could have been more about what was going on with Reid while he was away. It seems like the only time Morgan shows an interest in spending time with Reid now is when Prentiss "died" i.e. With Friends Like These. Now, it is business as usual, except for the pranks.

    Come to think of it, Morgan could have done something with Reid like the recertification thing after Tobias. That would have been interesting to watch! I get Emily is his partner out in the field but so has Reid been at times, like after she "died."

    I posted earlier as anonymous because I did not know what option would work for me as I'm new to all of this. Thank you for explaining things!

  50. Wait, you don't need an account or anything to comment? You can use the anon option with the link and not put in the link? This is coolio- thanks!

    Great episode overall. Of course not perfect, but it was fun to watch

  51. This is my second time to try this, hope it works this time around. What I see happening in S7 and this was something that was very obvious to me in S6 is the fast pacing of the dialogue. There's no opportunity to see the emotion behind the words. Therefore nothing that helps me connect to the character. This is especially noticeable in the team interactions and they're the ones that really matter to me. I want that aspect of the show to be at least as well written as the unsub. What I find with this pacing, no pauses, no lingering on faces is that the dialogue then comes across as if they're just spouting cookie cutter lines. Without this connection to our main characters then every
    mistake e.g. continuity issues or Hotch not being on top of Morgan's behaviour at the press conference or whatever, take on an importance that is out of proportion to the fact that this is just a TV show, it's fiction, it's entertainment. One of the things that got me hooked on this show however was my attachment/connection to the main characters and right now that feels missing for me.

  52. To Cerene: That was exactly my problem with the Morgan/Reid scences.

    "I enjoy the relationship between Morgan and Reid, it just seemed too forced and not natural last night. I prefer to see them teasing each other in the bullpen. The whole mention about the basketball thing and the pool would have been sufficient, it didn't need to evolve in a prank war during the case."

    And I also agree with you about Jack. They are making this kid way too sweet and special. Good for the people who love it but for me the Hotch/Jack scences are always too cheesy.

  53. Loved the episode especially the Hotch and Jack scene. Jack is a sweet, nice 6 years old kid. Glad to see that he is well raised by his dad.

    Loved that I had to guess who was the killer, don't like when we see him/her at the start of the episode, I like to try to find out who it as just as the team is doing the same.

    Funny the to see that Reid and Morgan play pranks on each others.

    Was good to finally have an episode with Hotch been so involved. Missed him last season.

    Hope we will see more of Jack with his dad this season!

  54. I really don't get how Jack is being portrayed as too sweet and special. He's six years old. Most kids are very sweet at that age and all kids are special. To each his own I suppose. I'll take as much of that cheesiness as they want to give me though because it's great to see that side of Hotch and that he has that little bit of happiness in his life.

    Breen Frazier's chat last night was wonderful and if you missed it you have to go read it when it gets posted. Issues some fans had about the episode were addressed and his explanation for the choices he made in the episode make perfect sense. I already liked the episode, but now knowing why he wrote some things the way he did makes me want to love it just a little bit.

    Also, while writing the episode he asked their FBI consultants if the prank Morgan pulled would be tolerated. They said it would be, and that one of them had actually done that very thing to another profiler.

  55. To sf81387,

    yes to each is own, I'm glad the Hotch fans enjoy these moments between Hotch and his son.

    I did attend the chat, it was interesting.
    I just don't agree at all with Hotch and Prentiss being able to understand each other like no other team members could.
    But that's just one writer's take, it's not established canon. That's the kind of things viewers can interpret as they wish. He certainly feed the Hotch/Prentiss shippers there who are now expecting to see constant interactions between those two.
    I just wish we could get more scenes between Hotch and Reid.

  56. Not a bad episode, but not one of my favorite either.

    I get that the agents need to lighten up and I understand the "logic" behind the pranks. I just hope it's not a recurring thing as I'm still not a fan of these scenes.

    The case was interesting and I enjoyed the whole 'not able to feel pain' angle taken by the writer.

    The Hotch/Prentss shipper got their scene, good for them.
    Apparently the same writer will have more scenes between these two in his next episode.

    It's great if it pleases the shippers, but, please, could you remember that Hotch and Reid used to have a great relationship during the first three seasons ?

    I hope to see more personal scenes between Hotch and Reid, I miss that terribly. Please ?

  57. I think if I were a shipper of any kind I'd being feeling a bit let down that he pretty much put the kibosh on the chances of any of the team members hooking up. (THANK GOD!)

    I can see where he's coming from as far as Hotch and Prentiss being able to relate to one another as far as being violated by a psycho. Hotch was attacked and stabbed in his home, had his family taken away from him, had his wife murdered and eventually ended up killing the man with his bare hands. Prentiss slept with a killer and then had that same killer invade every inch of her personal space, eventually kidnap her, torture her and stab her with a very large piece of wood and then she too lost her her family for awhile, and like Hotch was completely isolated from the people she loved the most. I think that Hotch can relate to where she's at in her head space right now and help her deal with that. He's lost so much over the last two years, but he also got two that he lost back and through it all he's managed to stand firm. He's a good choice as far shoulder's to lean on go.

    I'm assuming all of that will be contained in one episode though so there's plenty of time for some Hotch/Reid moments, which I too love by the way. I think Hotch has a special connection with each one of his team members that is unlike any connection he has with the others and that those relationships have been developed well over the years.

    As far as which team member truly understands Hotch and what makes him tick, I'm going to have to go with Morgan. He may not be able to relate to the trauma he's been through as well as Prentiss could, but Morgan "gets" Hotch and always has IMO.

  58. To sf81387: Finally something we agree on

    "As far as which team member truly understands Hotch and what makes him tick, I'm going to have to go with Morgan. He may not be able to relate to the trauma he's been through as well as Prentiss could, but Morgan "gets" Hotch and always has IMO."

    I always thought Hotch and Morgan "get" each other even though they are the team members who "fight" the most. Hotch and Morgan scenes rank among my favorite scenes in CM.

  59. I agree that they "get" each other and I enjoy their scenes. I think my favorites are the one at the end of "Mayhem" when Hotch explains to him why he didn't recommend him for Kate Joyner's job and I absolutely love the one at the end of "Retaliation" when Morgan offers to keep doing the reports so Hotch can get home to his son. They've had some good ones over the years......way too many to list them all. : )

  60. I think all the team members understand Hotch in their own way.
    They all "get him" in their own way and yes they all have a special and different relationship with him.

    Their experiences and background are diverse and it helps them understand their boss.

    Really, all of this is up to the writer : for Erica Messer Hotch and JJ get each other like no other and have a special connection because they're parents doing a stressful, time consuming job. They can relate.

    For Janine Sherman Barrois it seems to be Hotch/Rossi.

    Breen Frazier loves Hotch/Prentiss.

    ... All of this is really the personal take of the writer.

    I personally think the whole team gets Hotch in a different way : one might see things the others wouldn't but might miss others at times.

    In the end, all these characters have a special relationship with each other and they all understand each other in their own unique way.

    I personally love Hotch/Reid. We really saw their friendship and the fact that they cared, understood and respected each other a lot in a good number of episodes (LDSK, Tabula Rasa, Damaged, The Popular Kids, Revelations, Elephant's Memory...). They stopped showing us personal interactions between these two since season four, but I firmly believe that their relationship is still the same. I just wish we could see more of it, you know nice little scenes.

    And yes, thank god for the non shipper approach of the show ! I hope it never changes.

  61. I may post a more detailed view of the episode later - short version, I liked it. But, I am confused about one thing. According to the chat (the transcript is up btw) JJ being "Cheeto-Breath" was a shout out to fans. But, it went totally over my head. Is that supposed to be something I recognize? I'm pretty sure JJ's snacking habits have never been mentioned on the show before. And, as far as I know it's not something that originated with fandom. Is it something connected with AJ Cook? Or is Cheeto Breath the name of some celebrity and I've been living under a rock? Or is the shout out not connected to the specific nickname but just a reference to the friendship between JJ and Prentiss? I'm completely lost here.

  62. Angelwriter, on a another CM board there was a person who commented on every ep, attended all the chats, etc. and that person's screen name was Cheetobreath. And IMHO, Breen seen that and decided to use it. Hope that explains.

  63. Thanks, rockhotch. Yes, that explains it completely.

  64. I agree that this episode was a continuity nightmare. But it was fun. I laughed out loud and really enjoyed it. I will take an episode like that one over the stuff we dealt with last season. I appreciate the fun right now over the depressing crap we were given last year. The band is back together, let's not take it so seriously right now!!!

  65. I did read the transcript with Breen since I was unable to participate in the actual chat. It is an interesting read. I like what he has to say about Reid and Yale! I have always wanted the show to reveal more about his continuing education.

    It's great that there is going to be an episode where we will be seeing more of the genius side of Reid. I'm all for it! But I will be very disappointed if Reid's headaches are attributed to stress. I think the headaches were/are far too intense for that to be the sole cause. I would view stress as a cop out on the writer's part.

    I really hope that there will NOT be a return to the prank war between Morgan and Reid. I want them to share friendship scenes together like in the past where they actually talked to each other about things beyond the cases they were working on. And yes to the posters who are requesting more Hotch/Reid scenes! I still consider the one at the end of Elephant's Memory to be an all time favorite. More scenes like that one PLEASE!

  66. So, I finally managed to see this episode and I have mixed feelings about it.

    The good thing :

    Well written story and great case. I liked the fact that the unsub wasn't Randy Slade's partner from ten years ago. I also happened to find Randy's brother to be an interesting character. His scene with Rossi at the beginning was certainly abrupt but interesting ("You know how it is with fans. I mean you bang yours, mine kick my ass."). I guess his mother didn't need the attention that a search warrant would have brought, so her "no-nonsense" and not overprotective reaction made for a good scene in my opinion.

    I loved Reid figuring out the unsub's medical condition (pain asymbolia).
    The scene near the end with Hotch shooting the unsub had an extra edge because of that condition.

    The last scene with Randy's brother calling out his name while lightening his candle was a nice scene, even if it wasn't unexpected.

    Even if the MIT thing started as a mistake, they can't go back and erase what was said. It would be even more confusing for the fans if Reid now said that he had never attended MIT.
    So CalTech + MIT it is, and I honestly think it's great !

    On the not so positive side :

    I found the unsub's motive a little weak in the end.

    The sad thing is that they didn't need JJ to become a profiler to give her good scenes. The scene where she figures out the connection between the members of the 'top ten' makes sense not because she's a profiler but because she was the media liaison of the team. I'm sure that she would be more aware than the others of that kind of things (conference, interviews,...). Making her a profiler was an unnecessary move in my opinion.

    The scene where Prentiss just had 'a feeling' about Jack ...where did that come from ? So, I saw that this writer apparently loves writing Hotch/Prentiss but that scene didn't make sense.
    I wished they had let Reid give an advice to Hotch about Jack (and that they had found a more convincing way to sell it to the fans than what they did with Prentiss). Like others I miss the Hotch/Reid connection we used to see.
    But more than that, I don't get how Prentiss could just know something was going on with Jack,....I'm sorry but even if Breen Frazier loves Hotch/Prentiss scenes, I don't think Prentiss is closer to or more in tune with Hotch than the others (and Hotch didn't let anything slip).

    The Morgan/Reid pranks war. The idea is not bad, but Breen Frazier is totally right when he says that it's a question of tonality. I did find it distracting.
    The prank Morgan pulled with Reid's phone number sort of bothered me, but not because it was unprofessional of him to present himself as Reid. It bothered me because it made Reid unable to concentrate at some moments and was counterproductive for Reid's work and efforts. Usually they are so focused on the case and they try to not waste any time.

    That said, I don't have an issue with the idea of Morgan teasing or pulling a prank on Reid.
    Reid is, by canon, the youngest team member and Morgan sees him as a little brother. I just wished the scenes had been more nuanced.

    On a side note, JJ's comment about being on her campus ten years ago when the event happened made me wonder about her age.
    Well, we know she's older than Reid of course, but they never told us how old she was.
    I guess something like 34 ? Well, it's only a guess.

  67. After reading all these comments one thing is extremely clear to me: making everybody happy is impossible!!!
    Poor writers, their job is really hard. I mean even with such a good episode like this one, people mostly focus on the negative; why Morgan did this, why Reid did not have a scene with Hotch, why it was Prentiss who got to talk to him but not Reid or Morgan etc...??? OMG!!! I understand that we are all entitled to our opinion and are welcome to share it but come on, there are 20 more episodes in this season. Everybody will get their time! Be patient please, and just because Reid did not have a scene with Hotch yet, it does not mean that it is not going to happen. Plus that is not a good excuse to dismiss a good scene between Hotch and Prentiss, IMO, or getting upset about Morgan-Reid pranks. Morgan and Reid will have their wonderful conversations probably in the Reid centric episode or maybe even sooner. Please be patient:)


  68. To Sunyoung,

    I don't think fans are criticizing things just for the heck of it.
    Viewers have a right to state what they liked and didn't like about an episode. If they didn't there would be a real problem and it wouldn't be good for the show. You can't shame fans into silence because you liked something they didn't.

    I stated what I liked and didn't like, there were good parts and there were parts that didn't work for me. I just don't see this episode as "such a good episode" like you do. I loved "Dorado Falls", now for me that was a very good episode.

    The scene with Hotch and Prentiss didn't make a lot of sense, and I'm not saying that just because it's Prentiss.

    About the Hotch/Reid connection, it's hard to deny that it has been more than lacking since season four that's why fans are complaining.
    The Hotch/Prentiss shippers get their scenes, the Morgan/Reid fans get theirs too.
    The Hotch/Reid fans have been facing a dry spell since season four and I think they would simply love for things to change.
    I would much rather see a good scene between Hotch and Reid, one where they could connect, than one with Reid and Morgan, or one with Hotch and Prentiss.

  69. To Agathon;

    "Viewers have a right to state what they liked and didn't like about an episode. If they didn't there would be a real problem and it wouldn't be good for the show. You can't shame fans into silence because you liked something they didn't."

    First off all, I am not shaming anybody into anything, that is why I said, "we are all entitled to our opinion and are welcome to share it". So I agree with you! All I am saying is that there are 20 more episodes coming and I have faith in writers (who I am sure will write exceptional scenes between Reid and Hotch). My idea is not "shame fans into silence because I liked something they didn't". My only point is to offer another angle into all this simply stating that it will happen, please don't worry and be patient. I am glad that you loved "Dorado Falls", so did I. And there are things that I have been really not liking about the 7th season but I just (personally) would like to wait a bit and see how it goes from this point on. Anyways as I said, it is impossible to make everybody happy. I hope all Reid fans will get what they want soon!

    Second off all, although I love the idea of being able to share our ideas and opinions about each episode of this show, I think it is easy to go over board sometimes and this applies to everybody including myself not only you. Sometimes I think, regardless how much we would like certain things to happen, the writers will write what they want or will base their stories on whatever their understanding is of each character. Yes we should not give up the right to state our opinions (and that is not what I am suggesting) but maybe waiting a bit to see what is coming might be an option. That is just my opinion and I am not expecting anybody to agree with me...

  70. Guys, about the continuity thing, I've always related that both Emily and JJ went to Georgetown for their Master's Degrees. It makes sense that both of these very smart and overachieving people will get more education.

    So for Emily: Yale (1989-1993) and Georgetown (1993 to 1995), then CIA, then FBI at some moment (after 2003). For JJ (I think she is about 32 years old) so Univ. Penn (1997-2001) and Georgetown (2001-2003), she then goes to the FBI academy and the 8 years in the BAU.

    About the season, its definetly better than Season 6. I love the show and will have faith in Erica Messer, as she has always been pro-cast and pro-fans. My most inmediate concern is watching the show and see if it gets the ratings, this is important since Matthew, Kirsen and Paget do not have contracts for season 8. When this gets finalized it can help with the future vision of the show (9 seasons, 10 seasons) and that can help the writing also.

    I love CM fans since everyone is nice and polite. So thanks to all.


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