PREVIOUSLY ON Criminal Minds Prentiss (played by Paget Brewster) left, again, to head up the London Interpol office. JJ and Will got married. Good times! COMING UP NEXT | Things pick up three months later, after Morgan (pulling special duty at the...To read more and see an exclusive picture go to TVLine
Sounds like a typical Erica Messer episode. Create a situation to highlight Morgan and Garcia (why would they need Morgan for the Olympics ?)and add Straus. From the pictures it also looks like a lot of JJ. When will she learn to write for Hotch, Reid and Rossi?
ReplyDeleteITA,MESSer just wanted an excuse to have those 2 away when Alex joined the BAU,so we could see their reaction to the new agent.
ReplyDeleteFrankly I could've cared less I really wanted to see Reid's reaction since he knew Alex prior to her joining the BAU
I think this women becoming CM's Show runner was one of the worst things that could've happened to it.
I'm sick of her shoving her favorites down our throats and neglecting the other characters she doesn't favor as much,even if one of
them(Reid)happens to be huge fan favorite.
I'm also sick of these so called romances.This is a crime procedural,not a freaking soap opera.Unfortunately that's a concept MESSer seems to have trouble grasping.
This is what concerns me
ReplyDelete"And that is a good thing, because there will be a season-long threat to Hotch & Co. – though viewers will be privy to the big bad before anyone else. "
WE DON'T WANT TO KNOW BEFORE THE TEAM KNOWS!!!!
Why is this woman having so much trouble getting the concept of mystery through her head? If we know the identity of the year-long mystery killer in the very first freaking episode I am going to write an angry letter Every. Single. Week. to call her out on it, I swear!
I agree with the comments posted here and I know many fans who feel the same way. It's so frustrating to see the "mess" Messer had made of this show in two short years. :(
ReplyDeleteI feel I have to say as a fan of Crimainal Minda that the last season has been by far the best! It had everyone moments (yes even Reid moments) no they weren't tons of them like there was a lot of Prentiss moments but hey she came back from the dead! Rossi had his ex wife little arc and Hotch has Beth (who I love). Now don't get me wrong i love the whole team.
ReplyDeleteMorgan went to London maybe because one of his best friends moved acrossed a fricken ocean and he wanted to help her get settled in!
And I can speak for myself and probably others who ship couple that we don't always know why we do but it makes me happy! I'll admit some people go far but there are us out there that enjoy thoes small moments in there that were put in even if its not our paring. So let us be happy!
And you are complaining about Morgan and Garcia getting a lot of moments Reid used to get the same amount if not more! I personally like seeing the comptation caring side of Morgan! And if Garcia breaking up with Kevin didn't make you almost cry I don't know what is wrong with you! I will say I could do with a Reid episode or two next season but we know there will be! So If you can calm down and enjoy the amazing writing and acting from the amazing cast and crew!
I have to say I'm on the fence about knowing before the team but it's soemhing different watching the figure out something we already know. The one thing I'm totally certain about is I can't wait till its back on and I'm excited to meet the new team member and I might not love her as much as Emily right away but it takes time and an open mind! Don't just dislike her because she is not Emily see how she is different and what she can bring to the team.
i think erica got the worst writers they ruin er that show.erica talks so big she says stuff going happen it never does.just she said something about hotch and jj it never happen.iwonder ifshe is telling truth about hotch brother coming back on the show,now having unsla all season till the final.that is so stupidthey had the best writers before they let them go like andrew he was good they let him go
ReplyDeleteI'm sorry but I have to respectfully disagree with you about season 7 being CM's best one ever.
ReplyDeleteI happened to believe it was their worse season ever and apparently a lot of people agree with me.
I don't know if you are familiar with the Tubey awards or not,but season 7 earned CM a nomination in a category entitled"Worse season ever of a previously awesome show".
It pisses me off,that my favorite show got nominated in that category.
And I lay complete and total blame for it,at the feet of MESSer and these writers.
To Annonymous,
ReplyDeleteFunny that CM is viewed as a 'previously awesome show' by the Tubey awards because it is well known fact that Television without Pity NEVER liked CM.
As for Season 7, no it isn't CM best season but it isn't their worse, that was season 6. S7 had only really attrocious episode, had good to great episodes, 'Foundation', 'Profiling 101', 'Hit/Run', 'Unknown Subject'.
Brigitte
Well it wasn't well known to me,but it doesn't matter how the forum feels
ReplyDeleteIt's decided by the fans. CM has been nominated in both good and bad categories in the past.
As for those episodes you named with the exception of Foundation they were among my least favorite.
I especially hated Profiler 101.Garcia irritated the hell out of me.
Why was she even standing up there with them.She's not a profiler.
They made it seem like her ability to look thing up on the computer was more important than the actual profiling.
As for Hit/Run,It was pretty much the JJ show and I am not very fond of that character right now.
And just like the season as a whole Reid was pretty irrelevant in the finale.
So it appears we each have a different take on those episodes and that's perfectly ok.
I disagree with all of you, Season 7 was far from the best or the worst. No, the worst was Season 6 (No JJ/Prentiss "dying"/Seaver) and the best was 3 to episode "100" in 5. Season 7 started pretty badly but ended well IMO. "Hit"/"Run" was pretty much all JJ and no Reid, but it was still a very well done, very sweet episode. I loved the ending but then I also love the romance/background part of the show and I hope they keep that up.
ReplyDeleteBut still, Unsub = MYSTERY. Don't tell us, please!
Oh I agree with you about that awful Seaver character and I really missed Emily.
ReplyDeleteI'm sad that we are loosing her again,but at least this time it's the choice of the actress.
However unlike Seaver I'm willing to give the new character a chance.
Also I don't find myself missing JJ like I use to when it comes to season 6 bc her character has become so annoying to me now.
It's not that I'm exactly against the romance I just don't think they do as good a job as executing it,as it was done in the earlier seasons.
I definitely agree with you about the unsub.I actually would like for the show to do a mixture of both.
I do hope this season the emphasis will be put back on the team profiling the unsub,instead of the unsub committing the crime.
I don't mind a new bad guy and I don't care if we see him in the first ep. It is all about the story and how it plays out to me. I don't even care if he kills Morgan,or the new agent. I could live with that. I just hope this season isn't filled with ep after ep with the focus on the unsub. If the show is about "heros" then let us watch them catch the bad guy. The team can tell me why the unsub acts like he/she does, I don't need to see the unsub driving down a road in stupid slow motion shots to get that he/she has some issues. Less focus on unsubs, more focus on the team actually profiling and solving the case is key to me.
ReplyDeleteSeptember 17, 2012 4:55 PM
Good point Suz, if the show is about 'heros' then let,s see the team get into the head of the unsubs. Let them tell us why the unsubs do what they do and not they unsubs telling us. This is my biggest problem with the CM of season 6 and 7, too much focus on the unsubs.
ReplyDeleteThat said, I am thrilled about a season long unsub. I hope this unsub will be as or even more interesting then The Reaper!
The Bau is suppose to be an elite unit among the FBI and it was clearly evident in the earlier seasons of the show.
ReplyDeleteHowever the last 2 seasons,that uniqueness has pretty much disappeared.
We don't really see the team doing anything different from any other FBI agents.
I've nothing against romance in the show per say,but not if they are neglecting what is really important,the team profiling.
If MESSer can't do both then she needs to just stop with these so called romances.
Bc I sure as hell care a lot more about the team profiling than I do Garcia's relationship woes,especially since she's become so annoying with her whining.
Also Reid has been neglected long enough and I'm really hoping CBS will no longer allow him to be neglected like he's been.
Funny how none of the Reid fans complain about all the Reid centric episodes.I mean let's count:
ReplyDelete1.Somebody's Watching-Reid and the tv star
2.Season 1 finale-season 2 premiere(aka The Fisher King Part 1 and Part 2) where very much centered around Reid and his mother, yes the rest of the team was threatened too, but he was pretty much the core
3.Sex, Birth, Death- Reid and his fear of schizophrenia, connecting with the future serial killer
4.The Big Game/Revelations: Reid kidnapped and tortured
5.All throughout season 3-Reid's struggle with Dilaudid addiction
6.The Instincts/Memoriam- Explore Reid's childhood drama
7.Conflicted- Reid revisits his season 2 kidnapping and torture and attempts to help Adam
8.Amplification-Reid gets anthrax poisoning
9.Corazon- Reid has alarming headaches
10.Proof-Reid is upset with JJ and Prentiss
11.True Genius-Reid wonders if he should have used his brains differently
How was Reid ignored I ask you? I am a huge fan of Reid, I very much enjoyed all his story lines.Should I count all the Hotch centered episodes as well? I am a huge Hotch fan too.Granted, Rossi had less story lines.
Everybody has their opinion and that's okay, what bothers me is that you're pretending to be objective and you're not, you're just annoyed when your favorite characters don't get a story line for more than 5 episodes and when characters you don't like as much are finally allowed a story line or two.How many story lines did JJ get before season 7, more than 4? What about Garcia?
I'm going to have to do this in multiple parts.
ReplyDeleteRoxanne, I think the big difference was in how the stories in the earlier seasons were handled vs how they have been handled in the past 3 seasons. They used to at least try to give some equal time to other characters and Reid did not have the spotlight alone. For the most part, when the episode stared you wouldn't know within the first few minutes "this is going to be a Reid episode" or "this is going to be a Hotch episode". Pretty much now from the get-go you can tell. Ever since season 5 the writers seemed to feel that they couldn't give angst to more than one character at a time and the other characters would be pushed to the background. Most notably in Morgan-centric episodes. Another issue is the quality of the writing for the centric stories. We get a lot of Angry!Morgan and the way he is written makes him progressively less professional. Garcia became more whiny and annoying. The characters seemed to become mere caricatures of themselves.
Also, just because a character was well-written in the first four seasons does not make up for the character being poorly written in the past two and a half seasons. Midway through season 5 it seemed that Reid went through a personality change and the progress he made in maturing started to be reversed-- the writers didn't "get" his character. It has been a downslide ever since.
If you go back and look at the episodes in the first four seasons, it wasn't about Reid alone. Even though there was something important for Reid in those episodes, they were still predominantly team episodes. In almost every single episode one of the other characters played an important role as well. The case itself usually didn't take a backseat to the drama. I'll address the episodes you mentioned in order.
1. Even though Reid had his little fling, they still had a lot of Gideon and the team still worked together to profile. In the end, Reid confided in Morgan and got a pep talk.
2. As you said, every team member was threatened. Hell, Elle was on the operating table and we saw her hallucinating her dead father. Yes, we had Reid and his mother, but the other characters were not ignored. We also got to see Garcia feeling guilty about her video game getting the database hacked and Gideon sulking. There were good emotional moments for every one. The writers didn't seem to feel the need to give all of the attention to Reid alone.
3. This episode was also very much about the unshmuck and his struggle. It also had drama for Hotch when he was dealing with pressure from the politician. Again, Reid confided in Morgan-- and Garcia was there to comfort Reid. Again, this one was a team effort and a lot of the profiling was done by Hotch.
4. Despite the fact that Reid was being held captive, we did get to see how the team reacted to it and how they pulled together to work through it and try to save him. We learned about JJ being insecure and how Prentiss compartmentalized. We also got to see Gideon doubting himself and Hotch asking the team to tell him about his worst qualities. We learned something about the rest of the team members there.
5. Reid's "struggle with Dilaudid" was all but forgotten after the episode "Jones" in season 2. The only times it was mentioned afterward: season 3 "In Name and Blood" when Hotch said one of the team members "may have a serious drug problem", season 3: "Elephant's Memory" where Reid went to the BCC meeting. In that one we had nice moments with Morgan revealing things about his childhood as well. The next mention was not until season 7 when Reid outright mentioned Dilaudid to JJ in "Proof" (more on that later).
(continued part 1)
ReplyDelete6. This one did have a lot of Reid focus, I agree. But notice how Morgan was there for Reid and we had Rossi there for him too. He wasn't alone and we saw those characters supporting him. We also got some of the last of the actually amusing banter between Garcia and Morgan (before it just turned painful and annoying). Don't forget that this was a big thing for JJ because she gave birth to Henry. Again, the focus was not solely on Reid with no time for the other characters.
7. I have to say the whole polygraph bs in this one made me cringe, but it was still an interesting story. We still got to see the team working the case together and in the end Morgan was the one that went to comfort Reid. Ultimately it was still more about the case than any one team member.
8. The whole team worked in this one. We got to see drama for both Hotch and JJ worrying about their families. We got to see Prentiss questioning whether it was right to lie to the public and Rossi giving her reassurance. We got to see Morgan and Garcia worrying about Reid. Yes, I realize the team were thinking about Reid and in some ways that made it about him, but we were seeing them and their feelings/reactions. Plus that episode had Dr. Kimura who was portrayed by the actress who played the girlfriend in Karate Kid 2. It was full of win. :P
9. Did you notice you skipped over season 5 entirely? This was one very bizarre episode and it seemingly amounted to nothing since the story was subsequently dropped faster than a hot potato. We did actually get to see the team doing some legwork, and some great acting from the guy playing the unschmuck, Julio. Also, we had Morgan being the one to try to console Reid-- but seeming to have no connection whatsoever. We saw Hotch looking concerned as well. I saw a post somewhere that lists the episodes in the last few seasons and describes the focus of each one.
10. I will sort of disagree here because this awful episode was all about the retarded unsub. The team were more of an afterthought and their reactions/interactions did not quite ring true. We saw JJ being all upset that Reid was angry at her and not giving him time to cool off. It was just as much about JJ as it was Reid. We also saw Hotch trying briefly to mediate (I personally think Hotch realistically would have pulled them both aside and told them to focus on the case and work it out afterward-- if he knew there was tension and it might distract them he would have separated them). Then we got to see Prentiss giving a speech that made no sense but it supposedly magically fixed everything. Don't forget Rossi's pasta party with the hit the viewers over the head with the "we're a family" theme. Ugh. That episode was just so awful. The writer is, IMO, hands down THE worst writer on the show.
11. This was billed as a Reid episode but it was really more about the unsubs. I do think the balance was handled incorrectly. Had it been the writers of the first four seasons they would have had more of the team reacting and working together. This time we had Prentiss being the one to comfort Reid and then Reid's issues were all magically fixed once again.
I noticed you missed the worrying about schizophrenia in season 6 that was resolved in a single episode (which allegedly cured the headaches) when Morgan gave Reid a pep talk.
ReplyDeleteEver since season 5, they have pushed Reid to the background and only pulled him out for a few rare episodes. Whenever there is a Morgan-centric story, Reid is nearly invisible and hardly plays any role at all. Hell, other than Garcia, most of the rest of the team don't have much to contribute. The importance for the writers seem to be unsub first, then Morgan. He has had stories with issues that persisted through multiple episodes. In the past Reid always shared the spotlight with other characters when he had some focus. Now one or two characters get focus for multiple episodes while others are pushed to the back. I had a list somewhere about the focus in the episodes. Garcia has gotten a lot more now-- and she was just a recurring character from the beginning.
I'm not saying the other characters shouldn't get focus, I'm saying that they shouldn't do the focus at the expense of the rest of the characters. Other than the ex-wife thing and the Profiling 101 birthday fu, Rossi had almost nothing.
But I will say that it is jarring when they will pick up a story about Morgan's cousin from a prior season that pretty much all of my friends said they were not interested in, but they can't even touch on Reid's headaches. Messer gave all sorts of bs excuses on why it was dropped, but the bottom line was that she wasn't interested in it. Reid was less visible than any other character in seasons 6 and 7. He would disappear for large chunks of time. He had nothing to contribute in many of the episodes. In quite a few his dialog was dumbed down and he was shown to lack perception in comparison to his now uber colleagues. They diminished his character to try to make Seaver look better. They had JJ one-up him several times. They now think of him as a child and have forgotten his past and upbringing and how he had to grow up quickly. I guess the deal is that the Reid we are getting now is completely different and not nearly as good as the Reid in earlier seasons. He's not as smart and his lines are delivered like speed racer (apparently someone told Gubler he was annoying and that it would be better to just get his lines out faster so people wouldn't be as annoyed with him). That's another thing, they write the team as seeming to think of him as some annoying inept little kid as well. He doesn't get the same respect that he used to get. It was especially annoying that they brought in an addiction problem and had it be for a bit part recurring character, yet they couldn't come up with a better story for Reid (or JJ or Rossi). The wedding episode was even more offensive because Reid didn't even have any speaking lines for about the last 35 minutes of the episode and during the actual ceremony he was not even visible. Anderson, Strauss, Jack, and Beth were all visible but Reid was not. I think that speaks volumes about how Messer feels about the importance of the characters. It seems that she is even going to give more episodes to the Beth character this season as well. Quite frankly, I don't like that character and wish they would give Hotch a real story that doesn't involve a love interest. Maybe something about his past as a prosecutor or something.
TL:DR It's not just the quantity-- its the quality. Each season is a new thing and I think the characters should get equal focus (and unsubs should be put in the background). No single character should be pushed to the background and ignored so that another one can get all of the focus.
Zannej, Thank you so much for those excellent comments of yours.And you are right on the money about every thing.
ReplyDeleteI wanted to respond to Roxanne myself,but you have articulated what I wanted to say so much better then I could've myself.
i wanted to say thanks to zannej too. completely correct in every way. the quality of the show has steadily gone straight downhill in the last two seasons. it used to be a serious show about an elite team of professional profilers who track serial killers, and we would once in a while see into their private lives.
ReplyDeletemesser has turned cm into a sugary, romantic farce with the unsub thrown in as an after-thought. half the team is being ignored in favor of drastically rewritten characters (jj) or messer's own self in fictional form (beth). messer has lowered the tone of criminal minds into something cheap, cheesy, unintelligent, and immature.
The writing isn't as good as it used to be I agree but that doesn't change the fact that Reid has had more than his share of attention.Why does he have so many fans? Because the writers spend so much time portraying him. How many traits did JJ have before this season?
ReplyDeleteAlso, The Instincts for example, was about Reid until the very end, even after JJ gave birth it was still about Reid being the godfather. As for Reid being dumbed down, really? Must he really be the one to figure everything out all the time? God forbid JJ or any other member would figure something out before Reid.Are you also bothered when Reid figures it out when no one else does? Also God forbid JJ would get a season finale centered on her more than the rest right?
Also, I can bring the same arguments you did for the episodes where other members were in the spotlight and you claim Reid was completely ignored: for example in the finale, it was Reid who realized figured out the building will explode and it was Reid who had the adorable magic trick scene with Henry and the other team members had some story lines as well(since you referred to season finale).
Have you considered that you're bothered by the fact that Reid has taken a back seat for a while because you're so used to him being in the front all the time? I'm sory, but most of the episodes I listed where Reid centered and what I'm hearing from you is "Yeah but the other team members were around too so it doesn't really count". Same logic can apply to the Derek centric episodes, it's a two way street: in The Company, the entire team worked the case so we should consider this a shared spotlight episode no? In Profiler,Profiled the team was also there for Derek, Big Sea was ultimately about the case.
Other than getting shot and the the proposal story, what major episodes did Garcia have?
By the way, I meant season2 not season 3 regarding Reid and his addiction and also, season six was by all accounts a bad season. One last thing, JJ was virtually nonexistent in the first 6 seasons, why are you not complaining about that as well if you're all for equal screen time? Can you compare JJ's screen time in seasons 1-4 to Reid's, Hotch's or Gideon's?
Roxanne, darling. You missed what Zannej was saying completely.
ReplyDeleteI disagree that JJ was virtually nonexistent. I agree that she was not given a fair share of focus or good stories, but she was written as intelligent and strong. I never got the feeling that they treated her like she wasn't an integrated part of the team despite her status as a media liaison. In fact, I think some of her shining moments were when she used that role to influence/manipulate people. I loved one of the bits where a reporter was trying to get more info from her and she leaned in close and told him to reconsider his tie. She was sassy and cool. I really loved when she made up a story about the camp in the woods in "The Boogeyman". It showed her personality.
ReplyDeleteI actually feel that she has been diminished by being made a profiler and that the writers just didn't "get" her. I thought old JJ was great and just needed more of a chance to shine. Unfotunately after CBS pulled that asinine move of firing AJ because they didn't think old JJ was good enough. So now instead of getting old JJ back and giving her more good stories, we get the new JJ who seems to be almost completely different. I actually feel that making her a profiler instead of a liaison makes her less unique. They already had enough profilers so the contributions of each member becomes muddled.
I will point out that in the first four seasons when one character got focus (with the exception of things with Gideon) they did not make the other team members look stupid or inept in comparison. They showed each member bringing their unique expertise, experiences, and perspectives to the table.
I will take a moment to gripe that the writers seemed to think that in order to make JJ "better" she has to show up other members both intellectually and physically. They can't fathom that some people liked JJ because she was NOT a stereotypical TV female who could beat up men. Its one thing to show her defending herself, but the whole fight scene thing... Ugh. I think it would have been much more compelling had JJ used her intellect to trick/manipulate/talk down the unsub instead. (Plus, had she been written intelligently, she would not have been alone in the basement to begin with). These new writers don't seem to realize that a woman can be strong emotionally and intellectually without having to be in physical fights. When they did decide to show her intellect, Reid was made to look dumb in comparison on more than one occasion. I don't have a problem with Reid not being the one to solve every case, but I want his contributions to make sense to his intellect and who he is as a character. I really felt it was a disservice when they diminished him in "What Happens At Home" when they suddenly announced that Reid had to be pulled out of the Academy early because he supposedly couldn't do anything that wasn't learned from a book. They did that solely to make Seaver look better and try to validate her joining the team. It was especially insulting because part of Reid's strength is being able to figure things out-- something which can not be learned from a book. Part of being a genius involves the ability to solve problems and figure things out-- not relying on rote memory alone. I know people who are great at memorizing things but terrible at figuring things out-- and they scored poorly on IQ tests.
Going back to what I said about the earlier seasons, all of the characters were treated as part of the team. In the past two and a half seasons, Reid has NOT been treated as an equal member. The team interrupt him, treat him with disrespect (and not in the playful manner that was done affectionately in earlier seasons). Notice how he was not referred to as a Supervisory Special Agent when introduced in Profiling 101. They could have introduced him as an agent with the Doctor title. I encountered some people who thought that Reid was no longer actually part of the team and that he wasn't with the FBI and therefor that was why he was disappearing and not participating on the raids and such with the other team members. I even met some who were new viewers who didn't know that he was supposed to be a genius. I think part of the problem is that the writers just don't "get" him. Kim Harrison admitted that his voice was the hardest for her to get-- and she is the one who gives him the absolute worst dialog. She's also the one who said that she wanted to show him being responsible for a change-- which really boggled a lot of longtime viewers because his character is not, and never has been, some irresponsible child. From the music videos and interviews with the showrunner and most of the writers I think it is evident that they do not think highly of Reid. The one writer who favors Reid thinks of him as comic relief rather than a serious character and while she can show him being intelligent in some areas, she still has some misses when it comes to his dialog and behavior. What little focus Reid did get in seasin 7 was quite out of character. In season 6 even though he was the focus in "Corazon" he was written as somewhat stupid in some ways and did something that made absolutely no sense no matter how bad his headaches were.
ReplyDeleteIn truth, all of the characters have been dumbed down to an extent. There has been so much focus on the unsubs and so little screen time spared to show the team that we aren't getting enough of the profiling. We aren't seeing the members bring their unique perspectives and expertise. It's all become muddled to the point that IIRC, one of the writers indicated that the dialog is so generic that the lines are given to whichever actor is available for filming that day.
Even though Prentiss did not have a lot of focus in say season 4, we still had her perspective and personality put forth. Now it seems like they don't have time for that, the unsubs are the "stars" and the team are just a bunch of shmucks that could easily be replaced by another batch of blandly generic characters.
I admit that I was spoiled by the good writing of the earlier seasons, but I don't need Reid to get MORE focus than the rest of the team. I just want him to get EQUAL focus. My stipulation with the equal focus is that it should be done intelligently and in a manner that is true to the characters. I want that for all of the characters. I want them to return to being more realistic instead of being caricatures.
Obviously the formula in the beginning worked or else the show wouldn't have lasted so long. While the ratings have not taken a steep dive, they have dropped in the past few seasons with the changes.
Amber I agree with you 100% Judging from Roxanne's response, she did indeed totally missed the point Zannej was trying to make.
ReplyDeleteWell done Zannej.Once again you've made some excellent points.And I know that there are many,many people who are going to understand completely the points you were trying make,even if Roxanne doesn't.
ReplyDeleteTo Zannej,
ReplyDelete"While the ratings have not taken a steep dive, they have dropped in the past few seasons with the changes." Only true if you do not take into account DVR+ 7 days viewing, technically the numbers used by networks to renew/cancel shows are the C3 but those are not available to the general public, the closest numbers to the C3 are the DVR +7 days.
CM been pretty steady since 3. CM seasons(3-7) average are 3.5 demo for live plus same day DVR viewing, season 7 had 3.4 demo, not much of a difference and actually a lost is expected as shows age, regardless of quality.
So, let's look at ratings when taking into account DVR usage. Back in season 1, DVR were almost non existant before 2006 (1.6% in 2006) and 8% in 2011 http://blog.nielsen.com/nielsenwire/media_entertainment/as-tv-screens-grow-so-does-u-s-dvr-usage/ ) So when looking at CM ratings, you have to take into account DVR numbers up to 7 days as most shows which get DVR will be watched into that time period. This is significant because if you look at ratings for Modern Family ( the show that is the most DVR) the live numbers are very good (demo 5.0, 11.94m viewers) but with DVR Modern Family is a huge hit (demo 7.4 and viewers 16.7m viewers)!
If you look at DVR + 7 days viewing, CM actually have now higher ratings with the Live + 7 days DVR ratings compared to prior seasons. Season 6 had a 4.5 demo average for live + 7 days viewing and 16.26m viewers. Season 7 had a 4.7 demo average and 15.78m viewers. A rise like that, 0.2 rise is significant, is rare for a show in its 7 season. Actually with DVR Season 7 WAS CM best season ever in demo and 15.78m viewers only 420k less viewers than their best season which was season 6. Season 7 numbers are better than season 2 even if season 2 had the super bowl numbers in it which inflated the season average numbers.
So here are the ratings all the seasons:
Season 1 demo 4.0 viewers 13.8m viewers
Season 2 demo 4.5 viewers 15.8m viewers * this include the VERY inflated super bowl numbers of 26.0m viewers and a 10.0 demo, no not even Modern Family, NCIS, Idol or The Big Bang theory gets those numbers ;)
Season 3 demo 3.6 and 14.0m viewers
Season 4 demo 3.6 and 14.3m viewers
Season 5 demo 3.6 and 13.6m viewers
Season 6 demo 3.5 and 13.6m viewers with DVR 7 days: demo 4.5 viewers 16.26
Season 7 demo 3.4 and 12.6m viewers with DVR 7 days: demo 4.7 viewers 15.78
So, to look at ratings now, one has to take into account not just live viewing but DVR + 7 days to get the full picture.
source for the DVR numbers for the 2011-2012 season (CM season 7) http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2012/06/11/2011-2012-full-season-live7-dvr-ratings-modern-family-leads-ratings-and-viewership-gainsgrimm-ranks-number-one-in-percentage-increases/137441/
source for the DVR numbers for the 2010-2011 season (CM season 6) http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/2011/06/13/modern-family-tops-dvr-ratings-gain-for-the-2010-11-season-fringe-has-biggest-increase-by-dvr/95418/
Yes, I do have all the numbers for every seasons and every episodes ;)
Thank you for the numbers and links, Brigitte. I will say that one thing the live viewings note is whether or not viewers continue watching throughout the episode and if they drop off or not. I know a lot of episodes had more viewers at the beginning and end and that they lost ones in the middle. In some of the ones they had a significant dropoff after the first few minutes.
ReplyDeleteWith DVR that can't be calculated. Just because someone DVRs something doesn't mean they will actually watch it-- or if they do watch it, it can't be calculated if they actually watch it all the way through. I'm not saying that nullifies all of the DVR numbers, but I do suspect that there are a significant amount of people who started watching and didn't finish so I wouldn't take those numbers to be completely accurate in terms of measuring viewer satisfaction.
It looks like season 6 was a low point for the series.
Just out of curiosity, which episodes in 6 were highest rated and lowest? Also, which ones in season 7 were highest and lowest?
To zannej,
ReplyDeleteactually CM almost always have more viewers in the second part of the episode. My guest it is because people go from Modern Family to CM. You can check ratings at the Marc Berman site http://www.tvmediainsights.com/forum/?mingleforumaction=viewforum&f=1.0 Marc post the half hour ratings, there you can see how all the shows are doing at the half hour. Strangely, many of the CBS shows have more viewers at the half hour. Also, networks do know if people watch the show for the whole hours and how many will drop off and when because the C3 numbers does account for the commercials viewed up to 3 days after original airing. Actually, Networks gets the ratings in 15 minutes blocs.
Rating wise (with DVR, I take it into account because it is now such a big part of ratings) season 6 was CM second highest rated season in demo with season 2 and was CM highest rated season in viewers.
Season 6 highest rated was the season premiere at a 4.0 demo (those are live viewing as I don't have the DVR numbers but I could hunt them down but on average CM gets a 1.0 more when you factor in DVR) but it wasn't the highest rated in viewers, that was episode 7 'The Middle man' with 14.58m viewers. The lowest rated was 2.9 demo and 12.02m viewers for episode 12 'corazon'
For season 7, highest rated was the season premiere with 4.1 demo and in viewers 14.14m viewers ( with DVR that was 5.2 demo and 17.18m viewers. Lowest rated was a 2.8 ( with DVR 4.2) and that is a tie for episode 19 'I love you Tommy Brown' and 'profiling 101'. In viewers the lowest was 'Heathridge Manor' with 11.3m viewers ( with DVR 14.55m viewers). Why the big increase or the low live viewing? Because this was during Idol last few episodes, as Idol gets near the final the ratings always rise.
Something to take into consideration especially for those who would be tempted to jump to this conclusion ' some of the lowest rated were Reid episodes' actually, all the lowest rated episode happened against American Idol. Before season 7, CM only faced a singing show in the fall which was Idol. Since season 7, CM and actually Modern family rating went down, that is the live ratings, because of XFactor, the reason is simple, very few people actually DVR live competitions shows or sports. Also, unlike the big bang theory which face Idol/xfactor results show ( which always gets lowest ratings), CM and Modern Family faces the performance shows and those shows gets much higher ratings.
All this can be veryfied on the Marc Berman site on at tvbythenumbers site http://tvbythenumbers.zap2it.com/
Hope this answers your questions :)
To Zannej,
ReplyDeleteForget to mention, 'Corazon' went against Idol season premiere and idol does monster ratings with its season premiere. Also I said that on average CM gets a 1.0 increase, that is in the demo, should add that on average it gets also about 2.5m viewers more from DVR this was true for Season 6 ( from the numbers I saw on tvbythenumbers, again could I hunt them down if you are patient), for season 7 on average CM demo increase from live to DVR viewing, 1.2 for the demo and over 3m viewers.
Brigitte, Thank you for this information I am finding it very interesting.
ReplyDeleteEspecially the bit about Corazon.
I remember a lot of these so called Reid critics were trying to make the lower ratings about him personally.
Thanks, Brigitte.
ReplyDeleteIIRC, they actually postponed "Corazon" so that it coincided with the premiere of American Idol. I remember thinking that would hurt the ratings and that Messer would then point at the ratings and claim that it was because fans were sick of Reid rather than the fact that they put it up against a season premiere of a very popular show (which I have personally never watched). Plus it was a very unusual episode for CM and while I thought they had some great guest stars, the one-time writer (she never wrote another episode of CM) didn't quite "get" the characters.
These writers are driving me crazy with the spy arc stories that don't jive with the rest of the tone set in the series and then changing the characters. I'm still very irritated at what they did with Morgan and Garcia. I used to love Garcia and now I cringe when I hear her voice. I'm really going to miss Prentiss. I watched a video interview with Jeanne Tripplehorn to hear her voice and was very relieved that it wasn't annoying. I'm hoping that I will like her character.
I liked Rachel Nichols as a person but even if she had been a better actress I don't think she could have salvaged that character. The writing was just too inconsistent.
I'm going to try to keep my mind open about the next season, but I'm not going to get my hopes up because season 7 was horrible, IMO. At least season 6 had the excuse of the interference of CBS with the cast changes.
"Notice how he was not referred to as a Supervisory Special Agent when introduced in Profiling 101."
ReplyDeleteThis is how Reid was always introduced, it was Gideon's idea back in the good seasons, per your admission.
"[...]when they suddenly announced that Reid had to be pulled out of the Academy early because he supposedly couldn't do anything that wasn't learned from a book."
They meant he wasn't good when it came to shooting and other physical tasks, details also established in the early seasons.
You're pulling at strings, you see what you want to see and maybe so do I.You are right regarding some things but you're overreacting over others. Brigitte tried to show you that you're wrong about the ratings dropping a lot and that according to ratings many people still enjoy CM but you kept trying to contradict her.
I was in your position regarding House MD, I was a huge fan during the first seasons then season 6 was a bust and season 7 was more acceptable in some ways, in my opinion of course.I watched season 8 premiere and decided there wasn't much left of the show I once loved so I decided to stop watching instead of keep watching and then talking about how dreadful it had become on the internet and criticizing every little thing.It's just what worked for me in the situation of course.
I agree with absolutely everything that zannej has stated in every one of her posts here. I will re-emphasize that I think Erica MESSer is the worst thing that has ever happened to CM. To me, season 6 was bad, the first half of season 7 was as bad or worse, and the second half of season 7, for the most part (notable exceptions are "True Genius", which was okay, and "Foundation", which was very good with the exception of Reid completely disappearing for a huge chunk of the episode and the pairing of JJ & Morgan, who have no chemistry), was absolutely deplorable and downright painful to watch. I have zero excitement or enthusiasm for season 8 and have strong reservations about even continuing to watch at this point, which is quite sad and terribly disappointing.
ReplyDeletePurpleLily You are spot on with everything you said.Especially about Erica MESSer.
ReplyDeleteI'm glad you've also noticed the lack of chemistry between Morgan and JJ.
Now I am not a Morgan/Reid shipper,but I happen to think Morgan and Reid have good chemistry together.
I'd loved to see the 2 of them working together more this season,but I'm not that optimistic about it happening though since Reid is one of MESSer's least favorite characters and she just doesn't give a damn about the fact that he is a huge favorite among the fandom.
Erica MESSer is indeed CM's SHOW RUINER!